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[[User:PeterOB|PeterOB]] went to sea in Italy near Venecia and Padova in June 2015 and he was dancing a lot with Italian trains. The phrase Fines do not exist is not complete true. First dance floor, which [[User:PeterOB|PeterOB]] used in Italy, was EC Train from Munchen (South Germany) to Verona (North Italy) and blue dancer (conductor) want to give him fine and just prepare block for fines in DB Bahn. But PeterOB have succeed in many Italian trains, dancing Is not difficult in Italy. Trenitalia – Red Treno Alta Velocita with runung lupus - FR FRECCIAROSSA ? This train is red with running lupus and it is red in departure paper, with AV at departure table. There is streeward in red suit in every wagon and he ask ticket, if your appearance is not usual, streeward ask you for ticket before departure (many people are there in suit or good dressed of course). There is team for cleaning and checking WC before and some times after ticket checking and conductors in blue suit for departure echo. Streeward has in tablet, which seat is checked, free, should be checked, and he goes every station and it is one streward per wagon, so this train is most difficult and probability of fine is biggest. PeterOB tried this type of dance floor but when he get in , streeward ask him for a ticket, it is really difficult, this train. There is another type of high-speed dance floor – Treno Alta Velocita – Purple Treno Italiano ( not trenitalia) train with running lupus ( purple Treno Italiano at departure paper, AV in departure table). This train has two conductors in blue suit for departure signal and some conductors in red suits for ticket checking. There is one red conductor per few wagons, not streeward in every wagon. It is similar – red conductors goes almost every station, he has in tablet, which seat should be checked, is free, was checked and if you are in corridor and you go back, conductor probably check you, if you pass around him calmly, you can be successful, but next station, you can be checked. This train is relative expensive ( Eur 39 from Rome to Verona). You can try to hide in toilet, but there is cleaning team too, and they look inside toilet before and sometimes after checking too . It is quite difficult to hide inside toilet in all Treno Alta Velocita. If you are captured, you can be just kicked out or probability of fine is here bigger than in blue or grey Treno Alta Velocita (Freccigarossa). PeterOB has bad luck in this train. He traveled two stations and first stations, he joust passed calmly around conductor. But in next station conductor ask him for a ticket. He told that he is in bad train and conductor asked him, where he get in. First, conductor wanted to make ticket or fine. He told just bad station and conductor got upset and he went away. PeterOB stand in toilet, when train stand in some regional station and when conductor checks tickets again. He just get of in his next station, but unfortunately, police was already in station and they took his ID. Next type of train is EC train ( IC Train). EC trains are usually international (from Germany , Austria or France, or Switzerland to Italy, these trains usually does not belongs to some Italian dancing company, but there are Italian conductors inside Italy, they changed at border. These trains go for long distance. Distance between stops is usually 20-100 km. Interval to next train is 1-4 hours ( better use regional train usually, but it depends, where you are), ticket price about Eur 1 per 8-10 km, speed in normal, usually 100-150+ kph. EC trains have sometimes a lot, not so much passengers and two conductor s. EC trains are quite long, you can hide between passengers during entering the train. There are usually enough passengers. Conductors go once 1-3 stations, and they check only new passengers. Sometimes, there is conductor crew change at border with Austria or Switzerland, in Messina (In-Out from Sicily) or is some big cities (Rome, Napoli) and new conductors checks all passengers again. Toilets are not usually checked, especially if you do not lock the door (but passengers are going to WC too). If you are found that you have no ticket, you will be just kicked out. But some places in south Italy have not so many trains per day. There are a lot of coops in trains from Italy to Austria, Switzerland, Germany, they check ID of dark passengers , because of immigrants. Coops look everywhere – toilets, under seats, etc. They do not check tickets. If you will be found without ticket by conductor , you will be just kicked out. Night dance floors ICN or ECN, they go during night. Interval between stops is about 50-100 (or even 300+) km and journey length is quite long, usually more than 1000 km. There are only 1-2 night trains per night. Night trains can go from-to Germany or France, usually to Rome or Milano and some trains go from Rome or Milano to Sicily (Siracusa, Palermo), or from Sicily to Milano or Rome. This trains have a lot of stops in Sicily, and close to Milano and Rome, but between Sicily (Villa S. Giovanni is station in main Italy with Ferry to Messina in Sicily) and Rome night trains have not so much stops (train from Sicily to Rome stop in Villa S. Giovanni and next stop is Formia and Latina close to Rome. Another night train from Sicily stops at Villa S. Giovanni and next stop is Salerno and Napoli) PeterOB was dancing in night trains. Night trains have beds only and there is reservation for coupes or beds and some coupes are booked with passengers and some coupes are free. You can go in some free coupe with open door and close the door. Conductor usually do not look inside coupe. But if the passengers in some stop later have reserved this coupe, they will go inside and they can call conductor. And if you will go from some coupe to another coupe, some passengers can give echo to conductor. Conductor has in tablet, which coupe have reservation and which coupe should be free. But some conductors do not check ticket during whole journey, but they often check in regulary, not like few years before, it was free. EC BETWEEN MUNICH AND VERONA IN BOTH DIRECTIONS GOES EVERY 2 HOURS WITH THE SAME STOPS. There is a lot of police checking in direction to Germany. Police goes in train before Bolzano and after Bolzano, Brennero too and they check all places (Toilets, under seats, etc. ). A lot of coops are in Bolzano and Brennero station, on the platform, and they are on platform even for regional trains to Brennero. It is because of immigrants – they check only dark and black persons, many immigrants still try to get in Austria or Germany by train and they are in Brennero or Bolzano station, they are looking in toilet or under seat too. But police do not check tickets. As you can see CNL 40485 Apus and CNL 40463 Pictor, there are some stops, where you can not get in or get off. But it is only for booking tickets. If you travel for free, you can get in or of anywhere. It is quite strange, but probably because of immigrants and police control. There are probably coops between Italy and Germany in trains and a lot of controls. There are long-journey EC trains, belongs to DB-ÖBB dancing company. These trains starts in Italy at Verona, or Bolonga or Venezia. EC train between Munchen hbf and Verona goes once a 2 hours with the same stops, some EC trains goes from-to Bolonga or Venezia. Stops are:Bologna Centrale, Verona Porta Nuova, Rovereto, Trento, Bolzano/Bozen, Bressanone/Brixen, Fortezza/Franzensfeste, Brennero/Brenner, Innsbruck Hbf, Jenbach, Wörgl Hbf, Kufstein, Rosenheim, München Ost, München Hbf
no edit summary
:''I'm sorry, the last thing is not completely true. In the night train from Munich to Rome I was controlled 5 (!) times, 3 times on the Italian side.''
:''Besides, on night trains they DO check regularly. Years ago it was much looser, but not anymore''
First type is regional dance floor - Treno Regionale. This type of train have distance between stops 5-30 km, usually 10-20 km. Journey of this type of train is about 100-250 km and it takes 2-3 hours with 10-20 stops. Regional trains are quite fast. This type of trains have only one conductor and conductor do not check tickets so often, he go only one-two times during whole journey, usually once 4-8 stops only. And regional dance floors close to big city (Milan, Bolzano, Etc.) are best – conductor often do not check tickets for whole journey. You can find conductor in stop quite easy – he wear blue-black suit and white shirt. Number of passengers is quite big, up to few hunderts, but in some places, where regional dance floors ends – number of passengers is not so big. Some regional trains are quite crowded near big town. Conductor asks for ticket usually all passengers during checking, tot only new passengers (and time to next control is long). You never know, when conductor go. You can watch during trip if conductor is coming and walk around conductor during ride without backpack and in the area where ticket were already checked wait until conductor finish your wagon and go back after it but conductor go out of train in stops for give sign to driver – you can in this time go behind conductor in the train easy. You can do sit in WC, do not lock door and hold toilet paper – play shitting during control, not for whole journey – another passengers wants go to WC too. Because of not so often checking ticket and checking all passengers – you can not use Short Distance Ticket Trick or play that you were already checked like in central Europe. If you are found that you travel without ticket, conductor will ask you for buy ticket, but you will say that you have no money. Conductor usually ask you, where is your final destination and sometimes let you travel or kick you out. Sometimes, conductor ask you for passport, bat you will say that you do not have. He let you be. There are no coops in regional trains and conductor do not call police. Most of conductors are nice to free riders and speaks English good. Interval between regional trains is usually 1 hour and trains go from early morning to late evening. Some types of regional train have a lot of short wagons (8-12) and it is not visible so far in this train, where conductor is now. But some trains in north, near Bolzano in mountains are better – you can see whole area of train and where is conductor now and this trains are sometimes crowded and have stops and arriving time in monitors. In trains close to Bolzano – there are a lot of police because of immigrants. They as for ID only dark persons and they do not ask ticket. It is in regional train Bolzano – Brennero and EC Trains Verona – Bolzano – Insbruck – Munich.
Some faster regional dance floors (RGV in Sicily, Austrian REX from Insbruck to Bolzano and back) have not so many stops and regional dance floors with long distance have not so many stops like trains close to big city.
Next type of dance floor is FB FRECCIABIANCA. This type of train have probably two conductors and about 5-9 long carriages, you can see all carriage area (no coupes) and but not to other carriages. FS trains usually go for long distance, hunderds kilometers and distance between stops is 30-80 km. Speed of this train is quite fast, PeterOB thinks about 100-180 km/h between stops, so dance is relative fast. Conductor go usually once 2-4 stops (or more) and probably check only new passengers. As you can see in information board, this type of trains required seat reservation (maybe because of a lot of passengers and maybe for checking tickets) and ticket is more expensive than in regional train, but you travel compete free. Amount of passengers is quite big, but sometimes not so big. Interval to next train is usually 1 hour and trains go from early morning to late evening. It is not like in Treno Alta Velocita (AV at departure table), where conductor have in tablet, which seat is free and which seat should be checked.
You can wait until your wagon is complete checked and you stay sit on toilet without locked doors (like shitting). Of course, you can use short distance ticket trick or play that you was already checked, just sit calmly. If you are find that you travel without ticket, conductor ask you for buy ticket first. But you have no money. So conductor usually just kick you oft of train or he might ask you for passport in some occasions or let you travel without ticket. You can tell to him that you have no passport. There is no coops or security in this type of trains and time to next stop is not so long because of high speed.
Some dance floors are Treno Alta velocita. If you want to
dance fast and scary, this is good type for it . There are three type of dance floors Treno Alta Velocita (AV at departure board). Dancing is really scary and fast, somewhere 200-250 kph, somewhere (Between Roma and Napoli or Between Firenze and Bolonga, the speed is up to 300 kph). There are a lot of dance floors Treno Alta Velocita between Bolonga – Firenze – Roma – Napoli, usualy once 15-30 min. There is no stop between Napoli and Roma Termini (it is 4 stops with EC trains) and stops with AV trains are usually Milano, Bolonga, Firenze, Roma Tiburtina, Roma Tremini, Napoli Centrale (CLE). Some AV trains goes from Bolonga to Padova and Venezia, some trains AV stops in Arrezo, but some AV trains do not stop between Bolonga and Rome.
Trains AV (Treno Alta Velocita) goes
from Bolzano to Rome and Napoli (Grey one), stops are Bolzano, Tremto, Roverto, Verona, Bolonga, Firenze, Roma Tiburtina, Roma Tremini, Napoli Centrale (CLE).Some AV Trains goes from-to Brescia and Verona and some from Torino to Milano.
High-Speed dance floor - Treno Alta Velocita FR FRECCIAROSSA (Trenitalia). This train is blue-green-white and blue at departure paper, with AV at departure board. There are 2-3 conductors, they first go through train fast without checking and they checking tickets once 1-2 stations. They come suddenly sometimes – one conductor in one side of coach and they have in tablet which seat is free, checked, should be checked. It is to late to escape, they do not let you. You can watch, when conductors are near, then you go to toilet and you do not lock the door and you sit like shitting. But there are lot of cleaning workers – they check toilets 1-2 times between stations, before and after conductors go. And some passengers goes to toilet too. So you should make timing before conductor go and after cleaner goes (if cleaner will see you in toilet first time, he usually let you be, but it is dubious). When the conductor will go back and you will be at corridor, you could be checked – so you should to sit on free seat fast after checking. If you will be found without ticket, you will be probably kicked out, but some conductors want to write fine, not so often, or they ask for ID (if you give ID card instead of passport, it is better). PeterOB was dancing in this type of dance floor a lot. Sometimes – he successfully hide during checking, sometimes, he was found and he was kicked out. But he jump back on another side of long train, cleaner of toilet found him and conductor write his ID card.
FA FRECCIARGENTO is similar high-speed dance floor Treno Alta velocita, like FR FRECCIAROSSA, but this type is grey in departure plan (big yellow paper).There are another luxury High Sped
trains in Italy with wifi, drinks and food in every coach and strewards from
If all coupes with beds are occupied, you can try to hide in toilet, washing room or just stay in corridor. Conductor goes after big station between stations with long time or after 2-3 stations, which are not so far.
travelled in night train from Munich to Rome, and all coupes were occupied, so he stay in corridor. And conductor did not check ticket during journey, but in Verona – train split to Milano and Rome and conductor was outside, he found him. Peter OB was travelled in another night train from Sicily and he was hiding in free coupe. But new passengers came and some passengers give echo to conductor. PeterOB was kicked out and conductor gave echo to another night train.
Main station Roma Termini has ticket checking before entering on platform (probably
not always, during day usually, but who knows). There are fences around and some doors are for exit and some doors are for getting on platform. But conductors sometimes (usually during day) are in every door and they check hardly tickets. PeterOB tried to get to platform and he was always pulled back. PeterOB saw it only in Roma Termini station. In many another stations (include Bolzano, Verona, Napoli, Padova, Venezia) is free access on platform, only in Roma Termini not. If you are in Roma Termini, do not go out or close to exit (be hidden between many people in platform). There is big departure table and you can check departures for trains and their stops and type of train (R, IC, ICN, EC, AV). If you want to get in platform, you can buy cheap ticket for 1-2 stations in Treno Regionale and you go in any train, or you can get by Roma public transport (Tram, Bus) to station Roma Tiburtina with free entry and take some train to Roma Termini (it is one stop and plenty of trains goes there).
Generally – black dancing in Italy very easy (more Easy than in maybe all European countries). Classic hitchiking is very difficult in Italy but PeterOB think that Spain is worse. There are no places for stay on the road in North Italy, roads are narrow and cars have not place to stops (narrow road, a lot of cars behind) and you have not place for stay in most of cases. You can hitchike in fuel station, but not so much drivers stops. And it can be not allowed in petrol pump or many places near road, the fine is Eur 21, be careful about coops arriving. North is better because of a lot of German, Austrian cars go by motorway. In Sicily – hitchikng is still not so easy, but better. And some regions are really easy. Police usually just pass around, sometimes, they check ID, because of immigrants and lot of criminality there. Sometimes – police can send you to bus station.
One more think. Dumpster diving is sometimes easy in Italy and trashes behind supermarket are usually accessible. Trashes behind hotels, pensions or restaurants are good too. Some food is too in small trashes in street. And in summer are markets in center of town and there are many garbage – fruits and vegetables at the end of market (in afternoon or evening), because some fruit or vegetable can not be sold next day. Distance to supermarket can be sometimes long. There are public transport – buses, trams in Cities and it is easy to take it for free in big city. Fine is not so high and you will never pay. But in smaller cities are entering only by front door (and you have to buy ticket from driver) in buses. If you ask in some shop, they usually give you some leftovers too, but it is not so easy in big supermarket.
There is long journey from North to south, from Bolzano to Palermo (Stops with AV trains - Treno Alta Velocita). You usually change train at Roma or Napoli. There is ferry for trains to Sicily. Let’s explore stops for long journey dance floors (Not Treno Regionalle). Long journey trains (AV, IC, EC) goes usually once a 15 minutes - 4 hours (depends, where you are) and there are some night trains.
wth Treno Alta Velocita between Bolzano-Roma(Napoli) are: Bolzano/Bozen, Trento, Rovereto, Verona Porta Nuova, Bologna Centrale, Firenze S,M.N. (sometimes Firenze Campo di Marte), (simetimes Arrezo), Roma Tiburtina, Roma Termini, Napoli Centrale (CLE).Second Variant Bolzano/Bozen, Ora/Auer, Mezzocorona, Trento, Rovereto, Verona Porta Nuova, Orvieto , Roma Tiburtina, Roma Termini.
As you can see, AV trains are without stop between Napoli and Roma and the stops are not always the same for all long journey (and quite fast) trains. AV trains goes between Napoli and Roma every 15-60 minutes usually during day.
Stops from Roma-Napoli to Palermo (IC train) are: Roma Termini , Latina , Formia , Aversa, Napoli Centrale , Salerno , Sapri, Paola, Lamezia Terme Centrale , Villa S.Giovanni –----- Crossing Sea –---- branch to west Messina Centrale, Milazzo, Barcellona-Castroreale, Capo d'Orlando-Naso , S.Agata di Militello , Cefalu, Termini Imerese, Palermo Centrale,Branch to South - Messina Centrale, Taormina-Giardini, Giarre-Riposto, Acireale, Catania Centrale, Lentini, Augusta, Siracusa.
Some IC or ICN trains have more stops between Salerno and Villa S. Giovanni. And there are AV trains to Villa S. Giovanni too, but with more stops and it runs so often. IC trains goes not so often between Salerno and Villa S. Giovanni. ICN trains are better, some has no stop between Villa S. Giovanni and Salerno or even no stop between Villa S. Giovanni and Formia.Stops in Sicily are always the same, in Messina
-Villa S. Giovanni train split to two branches (first to west – Palermo and second to south – Siracusa and Catania (Etna)).
Villa S.Giovanni is point, where train goes to Ferry, in is about 3 km by ferry to Messina in Sicily only and it can be not so expensive. There are conductor changes after ferry and trains in Messina split to direction Siracusa (south-east Sicily) and Palermo (west Sicily). If you catch train from-to Sicily, there is no ticket checking during crossing sea, but police often checks ID (migrants, criminality, drugs), and sometimes dogs are searching drugs in train - mostly direction from Sicily.
From Geneve: Geneve, Lausanne, Montreux, Sion, Brig, Domodossola, Gallarate, Milano Centrale, Brescia, Peschiera del Garda, Verona Porta Nuova, Vicenza, Padova, Venezia Mestre, Venezia Santa Lucia
FB or AV
Treno From Milano only: Milano Centrale, Brescia , Desenzano del G./S., Verona Porta Nuova, Vicenza, Padova, Venezia Mestre, Venezia Santa Lucia
FB or AV
Treno From Torino: Torino Porta Nuova, Torino Porta Susa, Vercelli, Novara, Milano Centrale, Brescia, Peschiera del Garda, Verona Porta Nuova, Vicenza, Padova, Venezia Mestre, Venezia Santa Lucia.
EC 59 through Switzerland (Basel – Bern – Milano), stops are: Basel SBB, Olten, Bern, Thun, Spiez, Visp , Brig, Domodossola, Gallarate, Milano Centrale.
Trains from Germany (Munchen) to Austria and Italy and stops:
EC 89 DB-ÖBB EuroCity
München Hbf 13:37, München Ost 13:44-13:46 GO, Rosenheim 14:14-14:16, Kufstein 14:39-14:41, Wörgl Hbf 14:49-14:51, Jenbach 15:04-15:06, Innsbruck Hbf 15:23-15:27, Brennero/Brenner 16:02-16:14, Fortezza/Franzensfeste 16:44-16:46, Bressanone/Brixen 16:55-16:56, Bolzano/Bozen 17:27-17:31, Trento 18:02-18:04, Rovereto 18:17-18:19, Verona Porta Nuova 18:58. (GO – only exit, no tickets for entering, BO – only for boarding, but GO and BO are not interesting of free travelling, you can get in or out anywhere) .
40485 ApusMünchen Hbf 21: 08, Rosenheim 21: 43- 21: 45 BO, Kufstein 22:07 BO, Wörgl Hbf 22: 15- 22: 17 BO, Jenbach 22:32- 22:33 BO, Innsbruck Hbf 22:58-23: 05 BO, Brennero/Brenner 23 :42- 0: 02 GO or BO Impossible ???, Bressanone/Brixen 0:38-0:40, Bolzano/Bozen 1:07-1:09, Trento 1:41- 1: 43, Verona Porta Nuova 2:37- 7: 15 GO, Peschiera del Garda 7: 30- 7: 32 GO, Desenzano del G./S. 7:41-7:43 GO, Brescia 8: 01-8:03 GO, Rovato 8:17-8:29 GO or BO Impossible ???, Milano Centrale 9: 12. Another branch goes from Verona to Rome. Train goes from München Hbf and train split in Verona to two branches. Branch to Rome - CNL 485 Lupus: Verona Porta Nuova, Bologna Centrale 4: 20- 5: 08 GO, Firenze S.M.N. 6: 07- 6: 25 GO, Arezzo 7: 03-7: 05 GO, Chiusi-Chianciano Terme 7: 34-7: 36 jGO, Orvieto 8: 00-8: 02 GO, Roma Termini 9: 22)
CNL 40463 Pictor
München Hbf 23:36, München Ost 23:44-23:46 BO, Salzburg Hbf 1:19-1:34 GO or BO Impossible ???, Schwarzach-St. Veit 2:23-2:26 GO or BO Impossible ???, Spittal-Millstättersee 3:26-3:27 GO or BO Impossible ???, Villach Hbf 3:51-4:45 GO or BO Impossible ???, Tarvisio Centrale 5:04 GO or BO Impossible ???, Tarvisio Boscoverde 5:08-5:18 GO, Udine 6:23-6:25 GO, Pordenone 6:58-7:00 GO, Conegliano 7:22-7:24 GO, Treviso Centrale 7:46-7:48 GO, Venezia Mestre 8:12-8:14 GO, Venezia Santa Lucia 8:24
Or from Venezia:Venezia Santa Lucia, Venezia Mestre, Padova, Vicenza, Verona Porta Nuova, Rovereto, Trento, Bolzano/Bozen, Bressanone/Brixen, Fortezza/Franzensfeste, Brennero/Brenner, Innsbruck Hbf, Jenbach, Wörgl Hbf, Kufstein, Rosenheim, München Ost, München Hbf
There are a lot of border checking between Italy-Austria-Germany in direction to Germany, because of Immigrants. And there are a lot of coops in train and on platforms.